[SailfishDevel] Sailfish OS Open Source Community Collaboration Meeting 2nd of June 2016

Andrew Branson sfdevlist at andrewbranson.net
Thu Jun 2 12:22:38 UTC 2016


Hi!

RDBMSes are not very good at graphs, or trees, or any other data 
structure that requires variable traversal steps in queries. I don't 
think we have that here though. Those social networks only have graphs 
when they're integrating your data with other people's, but personally 
you just have your own address book and your own calendars. Both of 
those consist of many instances of the same data structures which need 
to be indexed, which is a good use of relational databases.

Your point about SQL being used out of habit is always pertinent though. 
It's important to keep on top of the NoSQL options, as SQL is definitely 
overused. I always find it very irritating when SQL is used only for 
config storage, using tables with single rows and many columns. Berkeley 
DB would be a good alternative for that. I don't know if the graph DBs 
are ready yet though - Neo4J is very interesting, but I would never run 
a Java server in a phone.

While we're on the subject, I think the Nemo thumbnail DB is a really 
good candidate for a NoSQL database. It's currently a huge collection of 
tiny files that seems to take up way too much BTRFS allocation, and I 
don't think as a collection of binary files it would be a good match for 
SQLite.

Andy

On 02/06/2016 1:42pm, Peter Kovacs wrote:
> Well SQL is in my opinion good for grouping or conduct  calculations on
> transactional data.
> Updating, or adding / sorting is not is best discipline. It is medicore
> in my opinion.
> On small sets of data as used in phones medicore performance is still
> quick. Phones are quite powerfull today.
>
> However the feature the DB should excel should be, in my eyes social,
> stuff. It is a phone after all, intended to maintain my social life, or?
>
> And Facebook, amazon, google+ does not use relational databases. They
> use graph databases. So I wonder why this is not used on phones. Neo4j
> claims to outperform relational databases by a factor of 1000 when it
> comes to relationships.
>
> I admit these softwares are very latest technology. And maybe not as
> robust as sqllite.
> However I would love to have a contact app which knows that Mary and Joe
> are married live in the same place. And when I search for one of the 2 I
> get the shared information. And when I update one end the app knows to
> update the other one too.
> Or it can store company hierarchies would help me in my business life. I
> am not good at memo these.
>
> Yes you can do that with sql. But I think it is easier more naturally
> done in a graph db.
> No problem if any one does not agree. I plan to build this anyhow.
>
> I am quite unhappy with Google in that because they are not doing this
> for me ;)
>
> Btw Object DB is good at storing objects as the name suggests. It is
> even more far away from the requirements on a phone then relational db
> in my eyes.
>
> All the Best
> Peter
>
>
> Tone Kastlunger <users.giulietta at gmail.com
> <mailto:users.giulietta at gmail.com>> schrieb am Do., 2. Juni 2016, 11:13:
>
>     Peter;
>     I'm curious, what brings you to the conclusion SQL (as in relational
>     dbs) is not ideal for transactional functionality?
>
>     On Thu, Jun 2, 2016 at 10:41 AM, Peter Kovacs <leginee at gmail.com
>     <mailto:leginee at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>         I would actually like to know why SQL stuff.
>         Datastructure types I am think of on the Phone are relationships
>         (Facebook style) or transactional.
>         And both are not ideal to solve with relational dbs.
>
>         I guess the Answer is because every one does it. But that is not
>         really satisfactory.  Would there be an interest to use
>         something else?
>
>
>         Tone Kastlunger <users.giulietta at gmail.com
>         <mailto:users.giulietta at gmail.com>> schrieb am Do., 2. Juni
>         2016, 09:33:
>
>             Hi Chris;
>
>
>              >2) API to access Calendar data.  Correct, currently we
>             don't provide access to calendar API in Harbour.  The reason
>             is that we want to use QtOrganizer as the public API, but to
>             do that we need to write a QtOrganizer engine backend >for
>             mkcal (note that one already existed in QtMobility days,
>             which is open source, so we can potentially adapt that one
>             with relatively little effort.  Help with that effort would
>             be greatly appreciated).  Eventually, I'd like to develop a
>              >QtOrganizer backend directly in sqlite, for performance
>             and maintainability reasons (mkcal has several design and
>             implementation problems, in my opinion), at which point
>             QtOrganizer can become the platform API (not just the 3rd
>              >party API).
>
>
>             I guess the worload to push it all the way to QtOrganizer
>             requires scratching the existing backend / rewriting a big
>             part of the cal app?
>
>             On Thu, Jun 2, 2016 at 5:06 AM, Chris Adams
>             <chris.adams at jolla.com <mailto:chris.adams at jolla.com>> wrote:
>
>                 Hi everyone,
>
>                 I will try to be at the meeting tonight, but I cannot
>                 promise (it's held at 11:30 pm in my timezone).
>
>                 A couple of the questions relate to areas I am involved
>                 with, so I'll try to provide some information in case I
>                 don't make it to the meeting.  If you have any follow up
>                 questions or discussion, feel free to contact me
>                 directly via email or on Freenode IRC (chriadam is my nick).
>
>                 1) Contact Note details.  This is tracked internally by
>                 JB#14734.  As you mentioned, it's supported in the
>                 backend, but not in the People app UI.  It was on going
>                 to be part of the apps overhaul which was planned prior
>                 to the financial difficulties last year, and since then
>                 this has fallen off the radar.  It requires design
>                 input, because you can have multiple Note details in a
>                 single contact.  I've just pinged our lead designer in
>                 the bug report again, in case he can fit it in sometime
>                 soon.
>
>                 2) API to access Calendar data.  Correct, currently we
>                 don't provide access to calendar API in Harbour.  The
>                 reason is that we want to use QtOrganizer as the public
>                 API, but to do that we need to write a QtOrganizer
>                 engine backend for mkcal (note that one already existed
>                 in QtMobility days, which is open source, so we can
>                 potentially adapt that one with relatively little
>                 effort.  Help with that effort would be greatly
>                 appreciated).  Eventually, I'd like to develop a
>                 QtOrganizer backend directly in sqlite, for performance
>                 and maintainability reasons (mkcal has several design
>                 and implementation problems, in my opinion), at which
>                 point QtOrganizer can become the platform API (not just
>                 the 3rd party API).
>
>                 3) Email app development.  Yes, you're absolutely right
>                 that the Email application hasn't received much
>                 development effort since Valerio unfortunately left.
>                 Yes, I would personally like to see it (along with other
>                 apps like Clock, Notes, and Calendar) opensourced. No, I
>                 don't know what the status of the opensourcing
>                 discussions with the Board Of Directors is, so I cannot
>                 give a roadmap for that possibility.  However, the
>                 "engine" of the email application is already open source
>                 (except for the Exchange/ActiveSync plugin) - we use QMF
>                 (Qt Messaging Framework) for email handling.  See
>                 https://git.merproject.org/mer-core/qmf and
>                 https://git.merproject.org/mer-core/messagingframework
>                 etc for that stuff.  Speak to Matt Vogt (mvogt on
>                 Freenode IRC) for code reviews etc.
>
>                 In general, the Sailfish OS wiki has been updated with a
>                 lot of information about the various software components
>                 which make up the Sailfish OS stack (including links to
>                 the open-source repositories), so you should be able to
>                 find most of the information you need to help develop
>                 these components, from reading
>                 https://sailfishos.org/wiki/Core_Areas_and_APIs and the
>                 drill-down links from that page.
>
>                 Finally, I don't know much about Bluetooth, but I know
>                 that we're looking at updating to Bluez 5 right now
>                 (development is currently ongoing to port the Qt stack
>                 across, possibly by using the KDE bluez-qt wrappers), so
>                 it's possible that the tethering issue will be addressed
>                 as part of that, with the new stack - but again, that's
>                 not my area so I might be incorrect.
>
>                 Cheers,
>                 Chris.
>
>
>                 ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>                 *From:* devel-bounces at lists.sailfishos.org
>                 <mailto:devel-bounces at lists.sailfishos.org>
>                 [devel-bounces at lists.sailfishos.org
>                 <mailto:devel-bounces at lists.sailfishos.org>] on behalf
>                 of James Noori [james.noori at jolla.com
>                 <mailto:james.noori at jolla.com>]
>                 *Sent:* Wednesday, June 01, 2016 11:15 PM
>                 *To:* devel at lists.sailfishos.org
>                 <mailto:devel at lists.sailfishos.org>
>                 *Subject:* [SailfishDevel] Sailfish OS Open Source
>                 Community Collaboration Meeting 2nd of June 2016
>
>                 Hi everyone!
>
>                 Following up last week’s postponed Community
>                 collaboration meeting on IRC, this week’s meeting is
>                 going to be held at the agreed time and date, 2/6/2016
>                 at 13:30 UTC.
>
>                 Please see this link for your local time (Redirects to
>                 timeanddate.com <http://timeanddate.com>)
>                 :http://bit.ly/247PwwT
>                 <http://redir.aspx?REF=g5j-y9bnU2VIldZnOnr8CS7-bSPOGw-1AMJwEvMljvQjLMD_gYrTCAFodHRwOi8vYml0Lmx5LzI0N1B3d1Q.>
>
>                 Location: #mer-meeting on Freenode IRC
>
>                 Chairperson: Jaymzz
>
>                 Duration: Approximately 100 minutes.
>
>                 Thanks to everyone who has responded and added topics on
>                 TJC:https://together.jolla.com/question/54157/sailfishos-open-source-collaboration-meeting-planning/
>                 <http://redir.aspx?REF=OlRBTW_rwoaCk_9FOorV7mZrXabeWUP7jnZySM69E7wjLMD_gYrTCAFodHRwczovL3RvZ2V0aGVyLmpvbGxhLmNvbS9xdWVzdGlvbi81NDE1Ny9zYWlsZmlzaG9zLW9wZW4tc291cmNlLWNvbGxhYm9yYXRpb24tbWVldGluZy1wbGFubmluZy8.>
>
>                 Proposed topics:
>
>                 -Intro (5min)
>
>                 -Bluetooth tethering - status of the fix (20min)
>
>                 -2016 roadmap (15min)
>
>                 -Show notes of contact (opensource contact app?) (15 min)
>
>                 -API to access calendar (15 min)
>
>                 -Email app development (15 min)
>
>                 - Requesting things to be added to mer-tools repo (5 min)
>
>                 - General Discussion (5-10 min)
>
>                 Please familiarize yourself with the topics before the
>                 meeting, as well
>
>                 as the common Meetbot commands
>                 https://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot
>                 <http://redir.aspx?REF=9bflfCySOf4l8VxPhhLe4rl_8CX0V51Eghusn5jTRNIjLMD_gYrTCAFodHRwczovL3dpa2kuZGViaWFuLm9yZy9NZWV0Qm90> (it's
>
>
>                 used for meeting management and logging)
>
>                 Best regards,
>                 James Noori, Community Manager at Jolla
>
>
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> Disclaimer: Diese Nachricht stammt aus einem Google Account. Ihre
> Antwort wird in der Google Cloud Gespeichert und durch Google
> Algorythmen zwecks werbeanaöysen gescannt. Es ist derzeit nicht
> auszuschließen das ihre Nachricht auch durch einen NSA Mitarbeiter
> geprüft wird. Durch kommunikation mit diesen Account stimmen Sie zu das
> ihre Mail, ihre Kontaktdaten und die Termine die Sie mit mir vereinbaren
> online zu Google konditionen in der Googlecloud gespeichert wird.
> Sollten sie dies nicht wünschen kontaktieren sie mich bitte Umgehend um
> z.B. alternativen zu verhandeln.
>
>
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